Published on May 6, 2005 By drmiler In Politics

Stop trying to destroy the gun culture. There are more than 250 million guns in public circulation in the U.S. They cannot be wished away. Even if the U.S. government banned gun ownership and stopped all gun manufacturing and importation, it would still need to confiscate all those weapons. Doing so would require wholesale violations of Fourth Amendment rights. The probability of getting rid of guns in America, therefore, is practically zero.


Then there are the people who own all those guns. The gun culture is a multilayered, multifaceted phenomenon made up of diverse, complex subcultures. Contrary to popular stereotypes, members of the gun culture are not all potential terrorists, unemployed skinheads hanging out at gun shows, or menacing warrior wannabes in camouflage gear. Not every gun owner is a member of the National Rifle Association; in fact, some gun owners dislike the NRA. Gun owners come in all colors and stripes: They are police officers, soldiers, farmers and ranchers, doctors and lawyers, hunters, sport shooters, gun collectors, feminists, gay activists, black civil rights leaders. Most of the shooters I know are normal members of their local communities. They have regular jobs; they go to neighborhood picnics and PTA meetings; they have children and grandchildren. They interact with their co-workers, bosses, employees, neighbors, friends, and families in socially positive ways.


Despite their differences in background and lifestyle, all these individuals have thoroughly integrated guns into their lives. Gun control supporters need to recognize that America’s gun culture has deep roots in American history and that pro-gun ideology has deep roots in America’s political culture. Even if the NRA were to magically disappear tomorrow, the gun culture would remain. The people who compose it are simply not interested in giving up their arms.


Guns and the gun culture are so intertwined with American culture that many Americans perceive guns as utterly, unremarkably normal. Most gun owners have unexciting, if not entirely banal, experiences with guns all the time. Claiming that gun owners are mentally ill or that the gun culture is a “cult” (as the historian Garry Wills has) will not change the fact that most gun owners are ordinary people.


The left should take this message to heart! The rest of the article is here:

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Comments (Page 1)
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on May 06, 2005
forum bump
on May 06, 2005
Sadly drmiler, you're beating your head against the wall. The rabid anti-gun people are too wrapped up in their little fantasy world to understand that eliminating firearms is not only impossible, but dangerous.

But then, if you really want to impose a socialist society on a people, the first thing you need to do is disarm them, isn't it?
on May 06, 2005
Sadly drmiler, you're beating your head against the wall. The rabid anti-gun people are too wrapped up in their little fantasy world to understand that eliminating firearms is not only impossible, but dangerous.

But then, if you really want to impose a socialist society on a people, the first thing you need to do is disarm them, isn't it?


True enough, which is why us gun-nuts will not let them get that far.
on May 06, 2005
Gun control-"the ability to hit ones target!"
on May 06, 2005

Gun control-"the ability to hit ones target!"

Exactly. 

I'm pro-gun.  But, I'm not a member of the NRA.  I don't want anything to so with them, to be honest. I'm happy enough to be left alone in peace with my concealed carry permit (not that it does me a lot of good in Illinois; however I can go across the river to Missiouri and carry concealed all I want there!) and my pistols, rifles and shotgun.

I guess I'm a member of the pro-gun culture that would survive if the NRA were to go away tomorrow....

on May 06, 2005
I agree with you here Miler.

I just have to wonder about the gun owners who feel they have the right to own any type of firearm (in particular fully auto) and justify it by saying it's a hunting rifle. Some of these guys are the stereotypical "gun nut" that the far left likes to portray all gun owners as. As a gun owner and believer in the 2nd amendment even i have to question some of the folks who actually are issued FFL permits and tax stamps.

The NRA? they seem to think every person in the country that isn't a criminal should be packing an auto MP5 based on their propaganda. I used to be a pretty loyal member until Mr Wayne LaPierre showed up.This guy makes Chuck Heston look like a pinko and Nugent look like a sissy mary with some of the statements he has made over the years, and his NRA "Enemies list" as well. I think the gun culture brings a lot of the grief they get onto themselves by choosing spokespeople like him to advocate their cause. I cancelled my NRA membership years ago, but still believe that you have the right to own guns for sport, target shooting, and personal protection. I just have to wonder if the Nuge really needs a grenage launcher to hunt antelope with. (He mounted it on his zebra striped Hummer)

Australia went through a similar situation a few years ago when they confiscated all the guns. They have had nothing but problems ever since.

See? We can agree once in a while i guess. Who woulda thunk it eh? ::
on May 06, 2005

I just have to wonder about the gun owners who feel they have the right to own any type of firearm (in particular fully auto) and justify it by saying it's a hunting rifle. Some of these guys are the stereotypical "gun nut" that the far left likes to portray all gun owners as. As a gun owner and believer in the 2nd amendment even i have to question some of the folks who actually are issued FFL permits and tax stamps.

Here's the Deal One Guy.  IN Nazi Germany they started out innocently enough and then used the gun registration to round up 'undesirables'.  Creeping incrementalism.

Ok, that is one example.  Now for the other.

In the US, we started out saying a woman has a right to chose.  We went to say that if the head is not out of a womb, it is a fetus, and so can be legally killed.  To the now fait acompli that a post partum fetus is not a baby.  And that if you cannot feed yourself, you have no right to life.  Creeping incrementalism.

that is why they defend the semi autos.  Creeping incrementalism.  Once you concede an inch, they want the mile.  It is not a theory.  It is now a proven fact.

on May 06, 2005
Gun registration keeps felons from getting guns at the local shooting shop...Works for me!

But it didnt answer my original question guy. You just clouded the air with right wing rhetoric. WHICH IS WHAT THE NRA DOES!

sheesh!

P.S. Semis are ok with me. I don't like bubba and cleetus firing their auto bushmasters behind my house is all.
on May 06, 2005
But it didnt answer my original question guy.


Actually he did answer the question. Perhaps you just didn't understand the answer.

Personally I don't think anyone needs to own a fully automatic weapon, but I also agree with Dr Guy's point. OK, we let them restrict full autos.(which they are doing now). Now that precident is established, let's restrict anything over a certain caliber. Now let's restrict all "assualt rifles" (which never was properly defined). Now let's restrict anything that can hold more than 10 rounds. 5 rounds. 1 round. No guns at all. Except for criminals of course.
on May 06, 2005
I just have to wonder about the gun owners who feel they have the right to own any type of firearm (in particular fully auto) and justify it by saying it's a hunting rifle. Some of these guys are the stereotypical "gun nut" that the far left likes to portray all gun owners as. As a gun owner and believer in the 2nd amendment even i have to question some of the folks who actually are issued FFL permits and tax stamps.


Sorry but this is where we part company. While I do not advocate owning a full auto firearm of any type. I see absolutely NO reason why I can not own any other type of firearm short of a grenade launcher. Show me "where" in the second amendment it says "anything" about hunting! What part of "shall not be infringed" do you not understand?
on May 06, 2005
Gun registration keeps felons from getting guns at the local shooting shop...Works for me!

But it didnt answer my original question guy. You just clouded the air with right wing rhetoric. WHICH IS WHAT THE NRA DOES!

sheesh!


Lets start with gun registration does NOT keep a criminal from obtaining a firearm. He wants one bad enough he gets one from the street with no waiting period OR registration. That's why these guys are called criminals. Second if bubba and cletus are firing full autos behind your house then call the ATF and have them look into wether or not they have their proper paperwork in hand. Full autos require special ATF permits to own and use!
on May 06, 2005
Lets start with gun registration does NOT keep a criminal from obtaining a firearm. He wants one bad enough he gets one from the street with no waiting period OR registration.


Oh come on now! You know perfectly well that no criminal is going to use a gun to commit a crime if it's illegal for him to have it.
on May 06, 2005
Lets start with gun registration does NOT keep a criminal from obtaining a firearm. He wants one bad enough he gets one from the street with no waiting period OR registration.


Oh come on now! You know perfectly well that no criminal is going to use a gun to commit a crime if it's illegal for him to have it.


Riggggght! And just what planet are you really from?
on May 06, 2005
Riggggght! And just what planet are you really from?


https://forums.joeuser.com/Forums.aspx?ForumID=17&AID=74449
on May 06, 2005
Riggggght! And just what planet are you really from?


Link


I would have thought "uranus".
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